share.triangle.com - City council waits to act on water rate increase - Comments

Nickels and Dimes

Visitor — Tue, 04 Mar 2008 22:22:17 -0500

My water bills are four times what they were 10 years ago. That's because the water bill looks like the phone bill now, a myriad of fees that nickle and dime you to death before you've used one drop of water. There's the rain tax (storm water fee), solid waste fee, recycling fee (which I don't participate in) , I think there's even an admin fee or something like that. It's rediculous! Local government has gotten completely out of hand; it can't provide even the few things that it has some business providing, all the while dreaming up new things to spend money on (civic centers, arenas, billion dollar light rail boondoggles, etc. etc. Meeker's a lawyer (and a lefty) so right away I know he's out of touch with reality, common sense and basic economics. If you think government has your cahones through the tax code wait until water rationing becomes the norm, not the exception. Next will be how much air you can breath. (actually how much you can exhale, because it's a greenhouse gas)

cake? your response is as American as Apple Pie!

plusaf — Sun, 17 Feb 2008 01:19:33 -0500

and the reason Ford and GM have been going down the tubes is that their employees have enjoyed excessively high wages, way beyond their contributions to the creation of their cars. If BMW sell high end cars to high end buyers using fewer employees and younger ones and lower-paid ones, don't blame the buyers for paying for them.

i trust you don't use bottled water at home, either. if you do, can you justify paying .03 CENTS [NOT 3 cents or .03 DOLLARs] for the gallon of water coming out of your tap, while the bottled water at your grocery is going into your bag at $1-$4 dollars a gallon?

you should ask why your tap water is so CHEAP and figure out that, at the cheap price, your utility delivering the water has no money left over to add to their SUPPLIES of water, so we're being asked to conserve!

read this first: http://share.triangle.com/node/13453 !

plusaf
Northwest Raleigh
27613

and Eco 101 also has some lectures on SUPPLY

plusaf — Sun, 17 Feb 2008 00:05:13 -0500

don't worry, they won't be listening. i've been writing and talking about increasing the SUPPLY side of the equation for two and a half years, almost from the first days i moved to Raleigh.

if your natural gas company or your gasoline company or your electric company told you that they were running low on supplies and you needed to cut your usage 30% or whatever, you'd raise holy you-know-what, and so would everyone else.

there's some kind of mental block when it comes to water. just because it comes out of the ground or falls from the sky seems to make people wacko about charging the right amount for it or looking for increased supplies.

i've asked why Falls Lake wasn't dredged in '05 to increase its capacity..... it would take millions of dollars and several years to STUDY the effects, and even then, the Army Corps of Engineers who OWNS and operates the lake might not agree to the changes.

is that stupid enough? so will it be cheaper to dredge in two or five years? no. will there be more users trying to milk the capacity of Falls Lake five years from now? more.

should somebody be fired for not delivering us what we want from them, due to their unwillingness or inability to figure these things out?

that is left as an exercise for the student, as the saying goes... or maybe "for the voter."

plusaf
Northwest Raleigh
27613

Yes, raising rates is the solution for the rich ...

Visitor — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 02:18:58 -0500

They continue to fill their pools, have their servants wash their cars, and water their lawns. They just pay the bill, no prob.

Uh, oh. All the pool boys, waitresses, accounting clerks, and other exploited citizens have had to move to areas that are better managed where basic life necessities can be afforded within their means.

All the poor rich people now have to cut and water their own grass, cook for themselves at home without servants, and wash their own dishes and cars.

So sad, except for us poor folks who now have moved to an area of the country that is under the jurisdiction of more intelligent government.

You, sir, are the one with the cynical view

Visitor — Sat, 16 Feb 2008 01:56:13 -0500

I can tell that you have never had to do without much, probably had everything handed to you.

For some of us increased water costs are not a choice between washing the dishes and eating out. It is the choice between eating cold food out of a can and paying the water bill so we can shower. We wash the dishes because we cannot afford to eat out.

With Ford already going down the tubes, and GMC joining them with record losses, and BMW reporting resounding profits, it's obvious that the working man is getting poorer, and the rich getting unprecedentedly richer.

DO NOT tell me to EAT CAKE!

conquer and divide or go forth and multiply

Count34 — Tue, 22 Jan 2008 16:31:16 -0500

I sense the citizens of Raleigh are frustrated. Not so much with the amount of proposed tax on life’s second most precious commodity, but with the implication that the well-being of Raleigh citizens is secondary to revenue – regardless of what other communities pay for water.

When an elected official proposes a primary objective to recapture lost revenue, the voters’ perception that their well-being is something other than primary is based in truth; while the underlying threat is unabated.

There may be only two critical issues associated with Raleigh’s water: 1) the amount available for potability, and 2) the cost of potability.

The suggestion that fixing both with an equal increase in price to all that have access to city water is known to be oppressive to those that use city water only to live, and own a calculator.

The clear solution to fix any purported revenue gap is to increase the price 1000 percent to those where water is a cost of doing business. Such an increase may neatly fill the revenue gap created by those that unselfishly conserve, while the COST to fill a 16 oz bottle of soda will change only about a penny.

When manufacturers can capitalize on the increase in materials for their products, offset the cost to the optional consumer, what dance will the City officials perform to fix the more important concern of supply?

We know where the priority is, when will it shift to where it should be?

It isn't a water shortage at all, it is the loss of revenue

Tapped out — Tue, 22 Jan 2008 11:05:18 -0500

I wonder if the 50% increase in water rates is really designed to push consumers to conserve water? Could it be our elected officials real concern? Loss Of Revenue!! I think all of the citizens want to do all they can to conserve but, is conservation really the issue here? No government official ever looks at conservation in a real form. When they see revenues in their coffers shrinking they think we need more money! We have the same issues all around with things like schools, roads, you name it. Poor planning and lack of foresight is the real problem. Growth can never pay for itself and taxing the people that have lived here for years so big developers and their pals can get richer has got to STOP!! Once again politicians have to take care of those that have given them big contributions on the backs of the poor. Now they declare, we need to cut back so they can continue growth and get richer at our expense. How many of you really think, when there is plenty of water, will the 50% surcharge be repealed? I think we all know from the past track records of other taxes and fees, they will become permanent. 1% here 1/2% there. When it reaches 100% of what you earn, what are you working for?

Raleigh water problems

Jim — Mon, 21 Jan 2008 11:44:16 -0500

Quite simply, it's a crock! Here's a thought, if you want to stretch the supply, STOP GIVING OUT BUILDING PERMITS! But nooooooo, can't be runnin contrary to businesses. Let all us little people pick up the tab for the city's short sightedness. And for all us in Wake Forest who saw this coming when our town council voted to be part of Raleigh's water/sewer system, ppphhhtttttt! We told you so.

Raising rates is the real solution

chadpetty — Fri, 18 Jan 2008 11:09:07 -0500

Rather than imposing arbitrary and hard-to-enforce restrictions, an across-the-board rate increase is the only sensible way to reduce the amount of water used in the community. Those in charge of setting the price of water are being irresponsible if they allow it to be sold cheaply when it has become increasingly precious. I hope the mayor and city council have the courage to go forward with this proposal -- it's too bad they didn't do it a lot sooner.

In the future, the price of water should continue to increase as supply goes down, and decrease as supply increases. That's what happens with everything else from gasoline to tomatoes -- it's the only way to ensure there will not be shortages.

Since Raleigh's storm water drains into the Neuse River...

Java55 — Tue, 15 Jan 2008 22:38:56 -0500

Perhaps the USGS could use their various collections of water monitor stations setup along a number of creeks including Crabtree Creek to guage just how much storm water is draining during any of the larger rain events, and using this data in as real time as possible, reduce an equal flow coming out of Falls Lake (or spead it out if neccessary for immediate downstream needs such as ecologic reasons) so that downstream flooding will almost never become a problem... except for extreme events such as those produced in the past by both Hurricanes Fran and Floyd.

That's a rather cynical view

Visitor — Tue, 15 Jan 2008 17:03:12 -0500

The wealthy obey the laws of supply and demand like everybody else. If you increase the price, some of them will use less. If you increase it enough, they will all use less.

That's true of less wealthy people also: I'm sure that in Raleigh, there are a few middle-class people who when faced with increasing water prices would still take a nightly bath in their one luxury, a jacuzzi tub, and decide to make up for it by turning the heat down or eating out less.

Nobody has an unlimited supply of money and everybody has to choose how to use theirs.

Have Meeker and the City Council Resigned Yet?

John Galt — Thu, 10 Jan 2008 08:44:04 -0500

Have Meeker and his city council resigned yet as a result of the gaffee heard round the world?

Good Grief! Every Corporate CEO, Board Of Directors and Stockholder of every major company in the world
within keyboard range of the Internet could only think one thing : If the mayor and city council of the largest
city in the Triangle best response to a water shortage is to use 25 gallons a day and smell like Frenchmen we
better not relocate there! What a bunch of Rubes!

If the Brainiacs at NC State( remember NC State? The brain trust that designed the original hog lagoons that dot
the North Carolina Countryside?) Duke, UNC, Shaw, St. Augustines, Peace and Meredith College(s) cannot decide
how to untangle a water shortage in an area with exponential population growth maybe parents of college age students
should look elsewhere for their children's education lest they absorb the deportment and demeanor of dolts after $100,000
in expenses.

If the ruling families of the area- the almighty Yorks and Goodmons- cannot intervene behind closed doors to keep their
governing class from embarrassing the entire region maybe people need to think twice before they consider the Triangle
as a relocation destination.

What a bunch of maroons! (As Bugs Bunny used to say!)

What about storm water?

Mr. Common Sense — Wed, 09 Jan 2008 18:10:12 -0500

When I experience a good rain, I see tons of water flowing down the streets and the storm drains. Why can't they figure a way to divert or pump water from storm drains around Falls Lake to Falls Lake?

Thank you for the opportunity to put this idea out there. If the powers that be can use it, they are welcome to take the credit.

water

Visitor — Wed, 09 Jan 2008 17:39:46 -0500

hmmmm, we're out of water so let's drastically raise the price...yea, that will make more water.

all of this reminds of the old saying - it's like closing the barn door after the horse got out. If only those in power had the common sense to impose water restrictions earlier life would be better. and perhaps people would not have to find ways to stretch our income to pay yet another higher bill.

Why Not Turn a Negative Into a Positive?

Laura — Wed, 09 Jan 2008 16:54:13 -0500

Instead of penalizing us by "doubling" our bill, why not offer us an incentive by giving us a reward for using LESS than we have in the past? Why not offer us money back for every gallon we SAVE?

I think that would be more attractive and would result in conservation AND public appeal!

City council waits to act on water rate increase

mwilliam — Mon, 07 Jan 2008 13:37:06 -0500

Flooded with hundreds of angry e-mails from water customers, the Raleigh City Council delayed voting on a proposal by Mayor Charles Meeker to temporarily raise water rates by 50 percent. Criticized for not doing enough last summer when the drought first took hold, the mayor now finds himself being accused of trying to make up for lost time with an illconceived and punitive proposal. Is the plan necessary or does it go too far?

Flooded with hundreds of angry e-mails from water customers, the Raleigh City Council delayed voting on a proposal by Mayor Charles Meeker to temporarily raise…